Opinion: Democrats violating every standard of due process, and it will backfire

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
[EDITOR'S NOTE: Here's an excellent column by commentator Marc Thiessen of the Washington Post, and rather than provide a link to the item -- published Oct. 25 -- the complete text is printed below, and it states how the Democrats' violation of every due process standard will backfire.]

By Marc A. Thiessen

After dozens of House Republicans demanded access to a secure facility in the Capitol on Wednesday where House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam B. Schiff (D-Calif.) was preparing to depose a Pentagon official, Democrats expressed outrage at the breach of protocol. “They’re doing this because this is what the guilty do,” said Rep. Eric Swalwell (D-Calif.). “Innocent people cooperate with investigations. Innocent people follow the rules of the House.”

Well, people engaged in impartial investigations aimed at finding the truth don’t violate every precedent and standard of due process set during previous presidential impeachments.

Contrast today’s partisan inquiry with the Nixon impeachment. As American Enterprise Institute President Robert Doar has pointed out, the Nixon inquiry was a model of bipartisan cooperation. The Democratic chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, Rep. Peter Rodino (N.J.), assembled a unified staff (including Doar’s father, John, a Republican whom Rodino appointed as special counsel). The full House voted on authorizing the inquiry. The minority was given joint subpoena power. The president’s counsel was allowed to be present during depositions, given access to all of the documents and materials presented to the committee, allowed to cross-examine witnesses, and even permitted to call witnesses of his own. Most important, the committee did not leak or release selective documents cherry-picked to make the president look bad.

The same was true during the Clinton impeachment inquiry. As former House speaker Newt Gingrich explained in a recent interview, Republicans “adopted every single rule that Rodino had used in 1973.” Yet today, Rodino’s party is systematically undermining every principle of fairness and due process he put in place in 1973.

Take this week’s testimony by acting ambassador William B. Taylor Jr., who alleged that President Trump made U.S. aid contingent on “investigations.” He was deposed inside a Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility (SCIF) in the Capitol, a room that is designed to protect the government’s most highly classified information. Cellphones are not permitted inside a SCIF. Yet somehow what appear to be cellphone photos of his prepared statement were leaked to the news media.

But the full transcript of his deposition — including his answers to questions from Republicans challenging his accusations — remains under lock and key in that SCIF. The president’s counsel is not allowed to see it, much less be present at the deposition to cross-examine the witness. So, Democrats are leaking derogatory information about the president, while restricting public access to potentially exculpatory information, all while denying him the right to see or challenge testimony against him.

Moreover, they are abusing the system to do it. One of the charges Democrats have leveled against Trump is that the White House improperly put the transcript of his call with the Ukrainian president on a special server used to protect highly classified information. Yet Democrats are doing the very same thing, conducting impeachment depositions inside a SCIF, improperly using a classified system to restrict access to nonclassified information not just to the public but to members of Congress. Talk about hypocrisy.

Let’s be clear: There is nothing wrong with holding hearings behind closed doors as long as there is due process. During the Nixon impeachment much of the evidence was presented in closed-door sessions. But there was not a flood of leaks from those executive sessions, as we are seeing today. And unlike today, the minority could issue subpoenas, and the president’s counsel was present to cross-examine witnesses and present evidence. Secrecy and fairness go hand in hand. One without the other is corrupt.
The partisan nature of the Democrats’ inquiry will backfire in a number of ways. For one thing, it allows Republicans to make the case to the American people that the process is unfair, and if there is one thing Americans demand, it is fairness. If the facts are on the Democrats’ side, they have nothing to fear from transparency and due process. Second, their partisan behavior has given the president justification to refuse to cooperate with the investigation, just as President Dwight D. Eisenhower refused to cooperate with the Army-McCarthy hearings in 1954. And finally, it has made it easier for congressional Republicans to rally around the president. Right now, Republicans are more torn about Trump’s Syria policy than they are about his impeachment inquiry. By failing to show even a modicum of fairness, Democrats have turned impeachment into a game of shirts vs. skins.
The Democrats’ conduct shows that they are not serious, and that the entire impeachment inquiry is a blatantly political exercise. Given the Constitution’s requirement of a supermajority in the Senate to remove the president, it is impossible for one party to remove the president of another party from office without buy-in from the other side. Yet Democrats are making no effort to win over Republicans, much less make an impeachment vote difficult for their GOP colleagues. And that means they’ll have a hard time getting buy-in from the American people.



 
Last edited:

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
[EDITORS' NOTE: Following are condensed notes from the above-posted article, itemizing the most-important points, for those who prefer not to read the entire piece.]

* People engaged in impartial investigations aimed at finding the truth don’t violate every precedent and standard of due process set during previous presidential impeachments.

* During both the Nixon and Clinton impeachments, (a) the full House voted on authorizing the inquiry, (b) the minority was given joint subpoena power, (c) the president’s counsel was allowed to be present during depositions, given access to all of the documents and materials presented to the committee, allowed to cross-examine witnesses, and even permitted to call witnesses of his own, and (d) the committee didn't leak or release selective documents cherry-picked to make the president look bad.

* Full transcripts of depositions remain under lock and key, and the president’s counsel is not allowed to see it, much less be present at the deposition to cross-examine the witness.


* Democrats are leaking derogatory information about the president, while restricting public access to potentially exculpatory information, all while denying him the right to see or challenge testimony against him.

* There is nothing wrong with holding hearings behind closed doors as long as there is due process. During the Nixon impeachment much of the evidence was presented in closed-door sessions, but there was not a flood of leaks, and unlike today, the minority could issue subpoenas, and the president’s counsel was present to cross-examine witnesses and present evidence.

* Conclusion: The Democrats’ conduct shows that they are not serious, and that the entire impeachment inquiry is a blatantly political exercise. Given the Constitution’s requirement of a supermajority in the Senate to remove the president, it is impossible for one party to remove the president of another party from office without buy-in from the other side. Yet Democrats are making no effort to win over Republicans, much less make an impeachment vote difficult for their GOP colleagues. And that means they’ll have a hard time getting buy-in from the American people.
 

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
I keep saying that dems are not actually trying to impeach. Their main goal is to taint the minds of the voters, and if they get lucky to piss Trump off enough so that he makes a mistake, all the better. It's totally pissing them off that he is so level-headed and composed in his actions.
 

REVerse °

Addicted Member
I keep saying that dems are not actually trying to impeach. Their main goal is to taint the minds of the voters, and if they get lucky to piss Trump off enough so that he makes a mistake, all the better. It's totally pissing them off that he is so level-headed and composed in his actions.
YES!

It's called election tampering. (2020)
 

WAMO

Spanking His Monkey
READ AN ARTICLE THIS MORNING THAT SAID A JUDGE HAS RULED THAT THE "INVESIGATION IS NOT BREAKING ANY LAWS".
 

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
I keep saying that dems are not actually trying to impeach. Their main goal is to taint the minds of the voters, and if they get lucky to piss Trump off enough so that he makes a mistake, all the better. It's totally pissing them off that he is so level-headed and composed in his actions.
Dear Greg T:

Absolutely. The main objective of Shifty Schiff and the Democrats is to leak selected information from the "inquiry" in hopes of driving Trump's poll numbers down, thus (in their minds) facilitating an easier path to potential and actual impeachment, with a "bonus" of affecting the 2020 election.
 

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
READ AN ARTICLE THIS MORNING THAT SAID A JUDGE HAS RULED THAT THE "INVESIGATION IS NOT BREAKING ANY LAWS".
Dear WAMO:

You read it correctly. A D.C. judge appointed by Barack Hussein Obama made such a conclusion -- which totally pushes aside due process -- but the appeal process is likely to take a long, long time.
 

9andaWiggle

Addicted Member
Interesting because I read an article in the Wall Street Journal yesterday that made some similar points regarding the established procedures of due process and how the Democrats have basically followed none of it.
 

WAMO

Spanking His Monkey
AT THIS POINT 9, I THINK ITS A HE SAID SHE SAID THING. IF YOU FLIP THE 2 SIDES: DEM AND REP: IT WOULD STILL BE THE SAME CONVERSATION. THERE IS SO MUCH POLITICAL BACKSTABBING AND FIGHTING GOING ON, IM SUPRISED THE COUNTRY IS RUNNING AT ALL.
 

bbfreeburn

Active Member
T4"he president’s counsel is not allowed to see it, much less be present at the deposition to cross-examine the witness. "
Do you understand how a grand jury works? The early part of the proceedings are akin to grand jury proceedings. No defendant or defense council allowed. Or, perhaps you feel that hundreds of years of jurisprudence is wrong? I haven't read the whole thread but if you think Republicans are being denied access you are wrong. About half of those present are Reps.

What's interesting to me is that after bleating that they have no access and the process is thusly tainted some Reps, now that open hearings are being scheduled, are saying that the hearings should be secret.
 

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
Dear bbfreeburn:

I certainly DO know how a grand jury works … and a grand jury hears evidence and decides whether a criminal allegation should be brought to trial. IT'S NOT DESIGNED TO GO IN SEARCH OF A CRIME, seeking to find criminal wrongdoing when it may or may not exist.
 

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
Dear bbfreeburn:

I certainly DO know how a grand jury works … and a grand jury hears evidence and decides whether a criminal allegation should be brought to trial. IT'S NOT DESIGNED TO GO IN SEARCH OF A CRIME, seeking to find criminal wrongdoing when it may or may not exist.
Agreed. I was of the understanding that when a crime has been committed, an investigation ensues. Not investigation of a person in search of a crime. I believe the the house should be charged with misappropriation of taxpayers' funds for pissing away money on dead end after dead end and doing absolutely nothing in the way of government business.
 

bbfreeburn

Active Member
I know arguing about this is foolish with you, but the crime is clear. Our commander in chief asked for a "favor" to gain information for his own benefit. Not for the national interest. The ask coupled with the withholding of money constitutes bribery. I know you won't see it that way, just as I won't see it otherwise, so I will attempt to not enter into this argument again. (but I probably won't be able to resist).
 

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
I know arguing about this is foolish with you, but the crime is clear. Our commander in chief asked for a "favor" to gain information for his own benefit. Not for the national interest. The ask coupled with the withholding of money constitutes bribery. I know you won't see it that way, just as I won't see it otherwise, so I will attempt to not enter into this argument again. (but I probably won't be able to resist).
But, the transcript shows otherwise. Where the guilt lies is in the video of Biden bragging about his quid pro quo and getting the prosecutor fired over looking at his son. Funny how that was swept under the carpet, tho. Are the laws not meant for everyone?

Is this not wrong, and illegal??

 

9andaWiggle

Addicted Member
But, the transcript shows otherwise. Where the guilt lies is in the video of Biden bragging about his quid pro quo and getting the prosecutor fired over looking at his son. Funny how that was swept under the carpet, tho. Are the laws not meant for everyone?

Is this not wrong, and illegal??

I'm stepping in to see if ya'll can clear this up for me.

Biden currently is not holding any office. What are the options (if any) on how to charge or punish him for this? I mean, is it an offense that would garner some kind of meaningful punishment if convicted? If it is, then who would be responsible for bringing the charges and why would they have not done so in light of this information?
 

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
I'm stepping in to see if ya'll can clear this up for me.

Biden currently is not holding any office. What are the options (if any) on how to charge or punish him for this? I mean, is it an offense that would garner some kind of meaningful punishment if convicted? If it is, then who would be responsible for bringing the charges and why would they have not done so in light of this information?
Simple answer. Laws dont apply to democrats.
 

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
I know arguing about this is foolish with you, but the crime is clear. Our commander in chief asked for a "favor" to gain information for his own benefit. Not for the national interest. The ask coupled with the withholding of money constitutes bribery. I know you won't see it that way, just as I won't see it otherwise, so I will attempt to not enter into this argument again. (but I probably won't be able to resist).
Dear bbfreeburn:

Just curious as to whether you feel that Joe and/or Hunter Biden did anything wrong with regard to situations involving Ukraine. Care to share your opinion on that?
 

AlwaysWrite

Addicted Member
I'm stepping in to see if ya'll can clear this up for me.

Biden currently is not holding any office. What are the options (if any) on how to charge or punish him for this? I mean, is it an offense that would garner some kind of meaningful punishment if convicted? If it is, then who would be responsible for bringing the charges and why would they have not done so in light of this information?
… but in lieu of the fact that Joe Biden is among the front-runners for the 2020 Democratic nomination, shouldn't such potential wrongdoing hold some significance?
 

JLS

Member
The liberal whack job dems are running scared...they know they have no one that can beat Trump...The commie bitch wants to break up Amazon. IBM, Micro Soft, Apple, Google and more...Just who do you think these MAJOR Corps will support in the election...

The Senate will never pass the impeachment...this is all a waste of time...Nancy saggy boobs knows her days are numbered...When Trump sweeps the Dems out of the House...Old Nancy will be sent to the glue factory...

The American People know that a socialist is nothing more than a fuxxcking communist...And hopefully when Trump wins, we will finally get rid of these commie bastarxxds....And CNN and CNBC...lol...But keep Brooke Baldwin...She has BIG EMS...lol

Plus the Dems want the Millennials 401 Ks....And when the Millennials pull their heads out of their asses and wake up...They will vote Trump..

You see, dumb ass millennals will hopefully find out what a communist is...they take money from everyone and pretend to give it to the poor...but keep it for themselves...and these bastarxxds call Trump a crook...lol
 
Top