Uh Oh! "Green" initiatives face a major hurdle

9andaWiggle

9andaWiggle

Addicted Member
Djarum300 said:
Coal mines are bad. Rare earth metal mines using slave labor in china is good.
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Two problems, from the article;

""There is no way there's enough raw materials being produced right now to start replacing millions of gasoline-powered motor vehicles with EVs," said Lewis Black, CEO of Almonty Industries Inc, which mines the hardening metal tungsten in Portugal and South Korea."

and...

"Earthworks and other environmental groups are now lobbying automakers to only buy metals from mines deemed environmentally friendly by the Initiative for Responsible Mining Assurance (IRMA), a nonprofit group. BMW, Ford Motor Co and Daimler have agreed to abide by IRMA guidelines, and other automakers may follow suit."

So demand will outstrip current supply, but China is not a solution approved by environmentalists because, well, like The Honey Badger "China just don't give a shit." Further, China is not trusted and should not be our only source since we're closer to being enemies than we are friends. Where else we gonna get it?
 
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Djarum300

Addicted Member
Greg T. said:
Don't forget that EVs have about 5x the carbon foot print as a fossil fuel vehicle.
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I've never read an article stating that. Maybe in the extreme situation, but I'm the worst case scenario, most EVs are at worst as carbon friendly, from production to fuel to maintainance as good as ICE.


The real problem is that 70 percent of the grid is still coal, and coal, per energy density, about half as good as gas in Carbon emmisions.
 
Greg T.

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
Djarum300 said:
I've never read an article stating that. Maybe in the extreme situation, but I'm the worst case scenario, most EVs are at worst as carbon friendly, from production to fuel to maintainance as good as ICE.


The real problem is that 70 percent of the grid is still coal, and coal, per energy density, about half as good as gas in Carbon emmisions.
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People NEVER consider the "other" costs when arguing EVs. Lithium mining for batteries, battery recycling, our power grid is still mainly coal, oil, and natural gas. Not only do they spew emissions, the fuel must be extracted from the ground to power the grid. The lithium mining and recycling, alone, is a major factor in emission output. Now, take the ground water issue of the lithium mines and you can add another "dirt" to the pile. Now, I'm sure the 5x number has decreased a tiny bit, but the fact remains that the "green" EVs are still way more dirty that our gas and diesel models. But, just the manufacturing process alone:
Building a gas car produces 17 percent of its lifetime CO2 emissions; the electric car generates nearly 50 percent that way, Lomborg says, citing a study by the Journal of Industrial Ecology. The EV produces 30,000 pounds of CO2 in manufacturing, the gas car 14,000 pounds. Now, one could argue that the tailpipe emissions make up for it in the long run, BUT, so far that has not been the case.
 
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WAMO

Spanking His Monkey
WE ARE NO LONGER DRIVING MODEL T'S EITHER. NOR ARE OUR HOME COMPUTERS THE SIZE OF OUR BEDROOMS. AS THINGS EVOLVE THEY FIND BETTER, MORE EFFICIENT, CLEANER, INEXPENSIVE WAYS TO MANUFACTURE THINGS. WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY HAVE ON THE TABLE THAT WILL REDUCE EV'S EMISSIONS? GAS ENGINES HAVE PROBABLY EVOLVED AS MUCH AS THEY ARE GOING TO. LOOK AT SOLAR PANELS. THERE ARE PANELS OUT NOW THAT CAN BE ALMOST FOLDED IN HALF WITHOUT BREAKING AND LAST NEARLY 20 YEARS LONGER. THE OLD ONES WOULD SNAP IN HALF WITH VERY LITTLE PRESSURE.
 
Greg T.

Greg T.

The Jizz Slinger
Once again, it's not about the "green". If all these GREEN Religion people were serious about emissions we would have done what I said we should have done many many years ago. I'm sure at least one person here should remember way back in the BR days when I was touting hydrogen powered vehicles, homes, machinery, etc. Hydrogen, even when used in an internal combustion engine, produces an emission of dihydrogen monoxide. An odorless, colorless, non-toxic substance some like to refer to as...............water. WHY have we not spent the proper amount of cash on the development of hydrogen power? I'll tell ya. Because eventually we'd be able to drive to our nearest spigot, pond, puddle, lake and fill our tanks with fuel. That's why. Again, it's all in the money.
 
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WAMO

Spanking His Monkey
GOOD POINT G. LOOKS LIKE NOONE IN WASHINGTON HAS BEEN SMART ENOUGH TO COME UP WITH THAT SOLUTION. MAYBE ONE DAY WE WILL GET A PRESIDENT THAT WILL ACTUALLY MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN. HE HAS OBVIOUSLY NOT ARRIVED YET. DARN IT.
 
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Djarum300

Addicted Member
Nuclear is the way. Most resistance is based on nuclear plants built decades ago. Not newmolanta with cutting edge tech. This would solve the natural gas and coal electric generation issue.


The left has been treating the whole green shit like a religion. A policy of reducing electric grid generation since wind and solar sure as shit ain't going to keep up at the same time pushing EVs is a terrible policy.


Let's be real here, the end game is that they know it won't work. The end game is control. They want everyone riding around in EV buses and public transit. They want to destroy rural and suburban life.

That is their endgame.
 
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