Mini-editorial: Baseless impeachment process reached a new low

[AlwaysWrite]

The Democrats’ baseless impeachment fiasco, which attempts to overturn the votes of 63 million Americans, reached a new low last week when Adam Schiff made the audacious claim that we can't trust our democracy to function any longer. The impeachment ringleader actually stated:

“The President's misconduct cannot be decided at the ballot box for we cannot be assured that the vote will be fairly won.”

The Democrats' blatant attempts to undermine the 2020 presidential election long before a single vote has been cast is a pitiful act that could affect Americans’ faith in the nation's electoral system.

Shifty Schiff has been deceptive and dishonest throughout the entire impeachment circus, and The Washington Post fact-checker gave him “four Pinocchios” for lying about his contact with the so-called whistleblower. Such a despicable man doesn't deserve to walk the halls of Congress.

 

[Greg T.]

Dead nuts on. After watching many hours of this fiasco, and following up with Fox, CNN and ABC I find it extremely difficult to comprehend the fact that the media is STILL with the democrats. WTF is wrong with them? They CAN'T all be that stupid. I found it very offensive how Schiff and company could get away with spewing the lies and fabricated "facts" as though they believe we're all that ignorant. Wait, it just hit me while I was typing. Yes, they DO believe all Americans are THAT stupid and they're confident (or, conceited) to the point where they just expect we're going to believe the shit they spread.

 

[REVerse °]

The Speech and Debate Clause is a recommended place to begin. The members of Senate and House are protected under this arrangement. In a nutshell it is a license to lie without any repurcussions.

Sad.

 

[WAMO]

THE NEWS HAS ALWAYS WANTED TO SWAY THE AMERICAN PUBLIC AND FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE THE POWER TO DO SO. NO MATER THE SUBJECT, POLITICS, BOWLING, MOVIES...IT DOESNT MATER. THEY ALWAYS WANT TO INTERJECT THEIR OPINION. WHETHER WE BELIEVE OR DONT BELIEVE, IS UP TO US.
AND THAT DOES SUCK REV.

 

[REVerse °]

THE NEWS HAS ALWAYS WANTED TO SWAY THE AMERICAN PUBLIC AND FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE THE POWER TO DO SO. NO MATER THE SUBJECT, POLITICS, BOWLING, MOVIES...IT DOESNT MATER. THEY ALWAYS WANT TO INTERJECT THEIR OPINION. WHETHER WE BELIEVE OR DONT BELIEVE, IS UP TO US.
AND THAT DOES SUCK REV.

Now you’re making sense. Well stated!

 

[REVerse °]

You Have Got to be Kidding?

 

[WAMO]

THEY DISLIKE TRUMP SO MUCH, THEY WILL DO ANYTHING TO STICK TOGETHER TO HANG HIM IF THEY CAN.

 

[AlwaysWrite]

THE NEWS HAS ALWAYS WANTED TO SWAY THE AMERICAN PUBLIC AND FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE THE POWER TO DO SO. NO MATER THE SUBJECT, POLITICS, BOWLING, MOVIES...IT DOESNT MATER. THEY ALWAYS WANT TO INTERJECT THEIR OPINION. WHETHER WE BELIEVE OR DONT BELIEVE, IS UP TO US.
AND THAT DOES SUCK REV.

… but there's no problem with trying to "sway" the public with EDITORIAL comment. However, most lamestream media outlets are now attempting to "sway" the public -- and succeeding all too often -- by peddling ULTRA-BIASED (and always pro-liberal) NEWS items with a fake news twist.

 

[AlwaysWrite]

THEY DISLIKE TRUMP SO MUCH, THEY WILL DO ANYTHING TO STICK TOGETHER TO HANG HIM IF THEY CAN.

Dear WAMO:

That's for sure ... but sometimes it seems as if you believe that Trump has to prove he's not guilty, rather than have the Democrats prove (beyond a reasonable doubt) that he is guilty.

 

[WAMO]

LOOK OVER IN ANOTHER THREAD AW. EVEN TED CRUZ SAYS TRUMP IS GOING TO HAVE TO PROVE HIMSELF INNOCENT. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF HIS TEAM WANTING TO CALL WITNESSES, TO PROVE INNOCENTS. NOT SIMPLY RELY ON THE DEMS LACK OF PROOF. HOW MANY TIMES HAS A DEFENDENT HAD TO SIT IN "THE CHAIR" AND SAY "I DIDNT DO IT AND I CAN PROVE IT". MILLIONS OF TIMES ACROSS THE U.S.!

 

[Greg T.]

LOOK OVER IN ANOTHER THREAD AW. EVEN TED CRUZ SAYS TRUMP IS GOING TO HAVE TO PROVE HIMSELF INNOCENT. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF HIS TEAM WANTING TO CALL WITNESSES, TO PROVE INNOCENTS. NOT SIMPLY RELY ON THE DEMS LACK OF PROOF. HOW MANY TIMES HAS A DEFENDENT HAD TO SIT IN "THE CHAIR" AND SAY "I DIDNT DO IT AND I CAN PROVE IT". MILLIONS OF TIMES ACROSS THE U.S.!

No, he doesn't. He only has to show that the prosecution is wrong. BUT, legally, he doesn't because no crimes have been named in the documents.

 

[WAMO]

SHOWING THE PROSECUTION IS WRONG? ALTERNATE DEFINITION; PROVING YOURSELF INNOCENT.

 

[Greg T.]

SHOWING THE PROSECUTION IS WRONG? ALTERNATE DEFINITION; PROVING YOURSELF INNOCENT.

This is getting worse than the gun thread. I'm out

 

[9andaWiggle]

This is getting worse than the gun thread. I'm out

A thought comes to mind about these arguments in general. You and AW are arguing the rule of law and how a trial works. However, this is not a trial as typically defined by our judicial system.

I sat on a criminal jury last summer, and the structure there was quite different. Here are a few that quickly come to mind;

Facts had to be presented in a certain and fair manner (hearsay and baseless alegations were not allowed).

Witnesses had not written books about the crime nor the people involved.

The judge and the jury were not the same people doing the prosecution/defense.

Media was not allowed, and the jurors were not allowed to speak about the case to anyone. Prosecution and Defense were not allowed to speak to jurors about the case.

Clearly, an impeachment is not a trial. It is more of a witch hunt, or mob rule. Objective consideration of the facts is apparently not part of the impeachment process.

Thus, I don't know why ya'll are arguing about it one way or another. Fact is, democrats gonna vote guilty, republicans gonna vote not guilty.

HOWEVER, one thing I do agree with WAMO on (perhaps for a different reason?), is that Trump is being forced to prove his innocence in the face of these allegations. Not to avoid jail time or Congressional removal of office, but to keep votes. And that is the end goal of the Dems. Impeachment/removal agreed to by the Senate would be a last second Hail Mary ending for them, but realistically, all they are trying to do is cast enough doubt in the minds of voters this fall. And to do that, they don't need to prove facts, they just need to sway opinion. And THAT is why Trump must prove his innocence.

 

[AlwaysWrite]

HOWEVER, one thing I do agree with WAMO on (perhaps for a different reason?), is that Trump is being forced to prove his innocence in the face of these allegations.

Dear 9andaWiggle:

You are correct that Trump is being forced to prove his innocence, but you are WRONG about WAMO because he is wrongly arguing that Trump is REQUIRED to prove his innocense.

You are also wrong when you imply that impeachment proceedings don't have to fall in line with American law. Regarding impeachment, we're not talking about a crime, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HIGH CRIMES. And you (and WAMO) seem to imply that the principles of evidentiary proof and due process don't necessarily have to apply when it comes to impeachment.

 

[9andaWiggle]

Dear 9andaWiggle:

You are correct that Trump is being forced to prove his innocence, but you are WRONG about WAMO because he is wrongly arguing that Trump is REQUIRED to prove his innocense.

You are also wrong when you imply that impeachment proceedings don't have to fall in line with American law. Regarding impeachment, we're not talking about a crime, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HIGH CRIMES. And you (and WAMO) seem to imply that the principles of evidentiary proof and due process don't necessarily have to apply when it comes to impeachment.

It doesn't APPEAR to apply, because nobody in these proceedings are impartial. They seem to try presenting this as a trial, but the rules appear to be totally different than what I recognize as a trial. Where are the impartial jurors/judges deciding Trump's fate?

 

[WAMO]

LOOKS AS IF BOLTON WILL BE CALLED TO TESTIFY. AFTER HIS BOOK CAME OUT, 4 REPS ARE SAYING THEY NOW WANT TO HEAR WHAT HE HAS TO SAY. IS THIS GOING TO BE THE PROVERBIAL CAN OF WORMS?

 

[REVerse °]

I don’t know, WAM. Possibly... You give them Bolton. Then, well, Bolton’s testimony raises doubts, so more witnesses will be needed. Then more. More.

Someone with authority needs to step in and say, Enough. This impeachment is political- not criminal.

 

[WAMO]

THATS IT REV. ITS JUST A THEY SAID THEY SAID CIRCUS. AS A FREIND OF MINE SAID, ITS ALL POLITICAL. PERIOD.

 

[WAMO]

THEN I HEAR DERSHOWITZ SAY, "IM SORRY HOUSE MANAGERS, YOU JUST PICKED THE WRONG CRITERIA". HE DID NOT SAY TRUMP DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG, JUST THAT THEY PICKED TO WRONG CRITERIA?